Interview with Alexander Heir of Death/Traitors, L.O.T.I.O.N., and Survival

Death/Traitors, Alexander Heir's clothing line, began back in 2007 and has grown in terms of output and iconography. A thirsty decapitated head lolling at the foot of a police officer? Boldly stitched Old English lettering? Probably a Death/Traitors shirt. Heir revels in cartoonish depictions of gore, while admonishing systemic misuse of authority and violence. It's ironic, right? Well, yes and no. Unfortunately, our society has a gross history of "irony" abuse. "Irony" as it was created and intended is a tri-pronged concept: Verbal irony is a statement in which the meaning that a speaker employs is sharply different from the meaning that is ostensibly expressed. Dramatic Irony is the device of giving the spectator an item of information of which at least one of the characters in the narrative is unaware. Situational irony is a sharp discrepancy between the expected result and actual results in a certain situation.

A lesser analyst would say that juxtaposing a message of empathy with images of violence and death is situational irony. And it is situational irony, to an extent, because the image doesn't necessitate the words or vice versa, though they manage to be paired together. It also isn't situational irony because anyone paying attention to the way things work knows that both the expected and actual results are that life is extinguished and life is born. Alexander Heir's message takes all of this into account. Life is hard. And a lot of people and things want to hurt you. But you don't have to buy into the cycle of pain.

Heir's industrial punk band L.O.T.I.O.N. just recently put out an amazing LP on Toxic State Records, which is available to stream. It's one of the best things I've heard this year. He also just recently held an art exhibition in Bogota, Colombia, and is working on new paintings.

JR: So tell me a little bit about your first forays into doing fliers and putting your art into punk. Was it always hand in hand?

AH: Well, I grew up around art because my dad was a photographer. I was always drawing and when I got into punk, it made sense. By the time I was sixteen or seventeen, I had done art for friends’ bands and t-shirts, but I was just doing art for people I knew. Years later, in New York, as the scene started to pop up again and be reinvigorated, I kept drawing and naturally made fliers for shows, starting off with ones that I had booked, but eventually people began asking me to do fliers for them, and it just kept expanding.

JR: Have you always lived in New York?

AH: No, I was born in Northern New Jersey, probably twenty minutes north of the city, and I’d go in for shows. I can’t consider myself a local, since there was a little bit of a transplant, but it’s always been close to home.

JR: Do you think there’s a pride in New York for having its robust arts community?

AH: Absolutely. Locals take pride in being from the city, but beyond that, I think people are proud of what we’ve made. New York was pretty dead for a long time, with the fallout of the Street Punk scene. Basically this group of friends from the Tri-State Area started bands and started doing things together. Toxic State Records started and an exciting scene started to emerge. There’s a lot of pride in that, on top of the fact that we’re making our own music. I don’t think anyone’s trying to copy another sound, scene, or era. Obviously we have influences, but we’re trying to make music for us right now.

JR: Toxic State’s one of my personal favorite labels around right now. Nothing sounds like any of the bands on that label. It’s incredible.

AH: All the bands are amazing and John’s got amazing taste for what he puts out. On top of that, everything’s screen-printed and stamped, as much as possible, and I think people can see the care that he puts into all of those records, which are still the same price as any mass-produced record.

JR: It’s already a bit iconic, even though I think it’s a fairly young label.

AH: I think the first release was in 2009 when he was still in Jersey. I think it’s a response to going to punk shows at the end of the 90s and seeing throwaway 7”s with poorly printed covers and mediocre songs that never needed to be released. What happened to the culture? That was the reason we got into punk in the first place - all the cool stuff from the 70s and 80s when punk wasn’t so solidified as a genre to rehash. People were exploring new ideas and being creative. I think that’s what everyone in New York is responding to. The spirit of punk in creative terms, rather than just studs and aggressive music, even though that is an important part of the culture too.

JR: When I hear L.O.T.I.O.N., and I’ve listened to your new LP a lot, it is punk, but it’s industrial too. There’s a lot of overlap, but those communities butt heads over a lot of things. It was interesting to see the synthesis.

AH: Yeah, well, first and foremost, I grew up with punk so that’s the perspective that I’m taking, and I like a lot of industrial music and the sounds that are associated with it, but I’m no expert on it. I listen to more New Wave and Postpunk than industrial. So I feel like it was a bit of an ignorant attempt to make this music, like the kid who’s playing punk for the first time, but he's trying to do it honestly. The first demos were literally just Tye and me in my bedroom with garageband, experimenting with distorted drum patterns I had made and recording into a 12” Orange Amp. Our big references were the Prodigy, and, for me, stuff like Nitzer Ebb, which is industrial, but more on the EBM side. What I like about L.O.T.I.O.N., and what tends to be my issue with a lot of contemporary industrial acts, is that we write songs. At the end of the day, a L.O.T.I.O.N. song can be played with a traditional four-piece punk band. It’s a rock n’ roll song with a chorus and melody. Some people purposefully stay away from that in industrial, but for me, I like pop music. A good song can be translated to any genre. The mentality was thinking that there didn’t need to be a spacey ten-minute intro - just fucking do it, bring it in, and pound it home. Once Emil joined, who’s kind of a noise guy, he brought his stuff in. That's where the sounds between the songs came from, which creates a lot of the mood.

JR: It’s a catchy record. I find myself having some of the mantras rolling around like “They Do This To People!” which repeats and starts applying itself to, you know, all sorts of things you see: surveillance, authority, and the overwhelming paranoia that was part of my life.

AH: Right. It’s corny, but I think back to this Jello Biafra quote about George Bush and how George Bush was the best thing to happen to punk because it’s something real to rebel against or fight against. It’s not just lip service at that point. Here’s the real New World Order in your face, but I can’t think of any American records that resonated with that or had a quality response from that time period. Now there’s plenty of things to be upset about and people are beginning to address their concerns in real and interesting ways. The idea built upon itself, using electronic instruments, then addressing the good and bad aspects of technology, and then the cyborg stuff fit nicely in place. It all started to make total sense. It built itself.

JR: Did you do the art for the inserts?

AH: Yeah, the insert art is me, and the cover art is a collaboration with Emil from Dawn of Humans, who does really interesting work where he’ll photocopy different parts of the body and collage them into monster shapes and figures. The back cover is him with me adding the layout and some of the texture on it. The eyes and mouth stuff he did was a real collage on a photocopy machine. The cover is his work too, photocopying circuit boards and other media elements that we had scanned. But the insert and poster was me. I don’t know if you saw the promo photo, the one in color that I posted, but we made prosthetic cyborg masks that we all wore.

JR: Are you a big sci-fi fan?

AH: I am. It’s funny. I don’t get nearly enough time to read or watch movies as I want because I’m always drawing and usually at the end of the day my brain’s telling me that it just wants to watch an Adam Sandler movie or Arrested Development, but obviously I love so much sci-fi, especially the imagery and visuals. I’m inspired by the illustrations, movie posters, and book covers. And, of course, a good sci-fi is always an allegory for something else. I really like Tetsuo: The Iron Man, which was a big influence. And Burst City, which is an 80s Japanese Cyberpunk movie - you can find the trailer online - and that band The Stalin is in it. It looks unbelievable. Robot police are shooting rockets at motorcycle-wielding speedpunks. You can watch a bunch of it, but the whole thing’s in Japanese. That said, I’m sure if you dig, you could probably download a dubbed version or you might even be able to find a legit release. And Terminator is the most obvious. You know, L.O.T.I.O.N. and the record design with the corporate-looking stuff was inspired by SkyNet and corporations like that.

JR: I think it’s really applicable. Terminator is so visionary. We don’t necessarily have robots stalking the earth, but we definitely have insidious technology.

AH: Well the technology we have looks sexy too. It’s not a hulking exoskeleton, but it might be a silver disk that can drop bombs, and people are reading your e-mails all the time. Although, have you seen pictures or videos of that MIT hunting robot yet?

JR: I don’t think so.

AH: Oh, it’s fucking terrifying. It’s this headless dog with four legs and it can run, jump, open doors. You can’t knock it over. It’s clearly going to be the future of policing.

JR: That’s not good…

AH: Yeah, well I guess the government funded it in the first place, but it’s insane that there are people who are smart enough to build this stuff don’t have the conscience to say “No, we’re not going to make you a hunting robot.”

JR: Yeah, well, that’s the same thing with Oppenheimer, I assume. I think that people of that caliber are sort of doomed to be used for sinister purposes.

AH: I think his philosophy was that someone else would have done it, so he may as well do it and give it into the hands of people who were “good.” But…I think it’s pretty ignorant to think that the U.S. government is a force of good.

JR: Yeah, well, who would you even go to, anyway?

AH: Right. I can’t imagine a single government that needs that. If you’re a good government, you don’t need that anyway.

JR: So when did you start doing the Death/Traitors clothing line?

AH: Death/Traitors officially started in 2007, a year after I graduated from Pratt. I had been doing other shirts before that at the Pratt facility, but about a year before I graduated, I bought a silkscreen press with some friends of mine, which we stored in our apartment for years until I finally got a studio. In ’07, I decided to try for serious and do it “professionally.” I started with a friend and for the first four years, we made shirt designs and printed them ourselves because we had the press. If we made a couple and sold them, then we wouldn’t really lose any money, and we could have a new season with new designs without having to front a ton of money, since we controlled the production. Slowly but surely we kept making ends. We’d have parties or shows or give shirts to our friends, and we made the website more professional, and figured out the imagery and idea. Things just came together and picked up from there. In 2010 or 2011, my partner and I split ways amicably. He was into other stuff and this was my life. I wanted to do it all. So I took it over and the imagery solidified itself, including the concepts behind it, and the line itself formed. I began to get a little bit of buzz.

JR: Let’s talk a little bit about your imagery. When I first saw your clothes, I thought it was like the bleakest thing I’d ever seen, but eventually I realized that there was a lot of hope in it. There’s such a juxtaposition between the peace and violence in your work.

AH: Yeah, I think of that saying: “A hippie is a mean person who looks nice and a punk is a nice person who looks mean.” I think the same thing is true for my line. As far as style and imagery goes, that’s what I like - that’s what we like. Scary, tough, bleak stuff with skulls and death. Our culture is into that in general. I, personally, am really into these Japanese depictions of gore that are almost cartoonish - ridiculous, comic book kinds of stuff. But I juxtapose it with messages that I believe are important. You can be a punk, but that doesn’t mean you don’t have a brain or you’re pro-war. When I first started doing it, I was way into masonic and illuminati stuff, like the power of symbols. At the end of the day, even if there is no real secret behind these groups, the symbols remain inherently powerful - they affect people. How can you harness the power of these images and get the message that you’re trying to direct to people, instead of having it be a secretive thing?

AH: Initially, I was using a lot of Japanese because I like the idea that you can put a word or phrase on a shirt, and most people in America would have no idea what it says, but it’s out there for everyone. You could still go home and translate it or ask someone, but there’s a level of a secret meaning, and plus, I’ve always loved the way that Japanese lettering and kanji has looked. Eventually, I stopped doing that as much. I didn’t want to get to the point where I was unsure about cultural appropriation. It started to become a trope too. So on the newer shirts, there’s this almost illegible, vertical Old English. From a distance it’s hard to read, but when you’re close up, you can read what it says. It’s like subliminal messaging. Again, when I first started, along with the Illuminati, secret society stuff, I was looking at fascist imagery - medallions, nazi stuff - it’s so powerful and even now people who aren’t even fascist are riffing on it. So I started thinking “how can I take this imagery, but instead of using it for a fascist state use it to promote freedom and empathy?” The power of these images isn’t necessarily good or evil. It’s how you attribute it.

JR: Do you think there’s a single message to your visual art?

AH: I don’t think there’s one particular thing - it's reporting. Some of my duty as an artist of my time is to report about what’s happening in the world and how I feel about it. In general with Death/Traitors the idea is propaganda for…well, “peace” is such a simplistic word, but anti-oppressive propaganda or anti-fascist propaganda. Again, all these words are so monolithic and singular, but the general idea is empathy.

AH: In the 90s, it was uncool to care or to give a shit. Someone would say “Oh, what? You’re a fucking hippie?” And I don’t think having a moral compass or a care in the world makes you a squishy liberal or a bleeding heart bike punk. You can have a mohawk and studs too. That’s what punk is.

JR: Absolutely. I think that’s how it started. A lot of people talk about the Sex Pistols being the first punk band, but the Sex Pistols were also almost a boy band. Real punk bands were like the Ramones, Minor Threat, Bad Brains, Circle Jerks. I think those guys definitely stood for a lot of things.

AH: Absolutely, and I don’t think it needs to get to the point where you’re giving everyone directives, either. That’s one of the things I like to consider with my work - I don’t want to be preaching. First and foremost, people are buying my record or wearing my clothes because it sounds good or looks good. I don’t want to tell them what to do, but I want to report what I see and do. You can talk and talk, but the way you conduct yourself matters a lot more than what you say in your lyrics. There are plenty of bands who have plenty to say that don’t back it up with actions. There are also bands that get flagged as being apolitical, but who do a lot for the community. Like Toxic State - most of those bands aren’t overtly political, but it’s this totally independent DIY thing and John gives bands the best deals, works with everyone, donates money to charity and doesn’t need to tell anyone. Actions speak louder than words.

JR: Do you get to travel a lot for your art?

AH: In the past two years I’ve started to do some traveling. I went to Europe in early October last year, and now I’m going out to Bogota in the next couple weeks, and then I plan on going to Berlin to meet up with Anasazi at the end of the year. I’ve got friends there too. That’s the cool thing about punk - I’ve met tons of people over the years just from them coming to New York or the general area. And eventually with all these connections it’s like: You can set up a DIY punk show? I can set up a DIY art show too. I don’t need to worry about selling a $500 or $1000 painting because I can sell a bunch of shirts and at least make my money back. Some people argue that a twenty dollar t-shirt is little expensive, and yeah, it’s not cheap - it’s not a ten dollar punk shirt, but it’s a hand-printed wearable art piece. I design it and print it so twenty bucks for an original print that you can wear isn’t so bad. That’s what allowed me to be an artist and work for myself instead of showing in galleries and expecting one person to pay a lot for one piece. I’d rather keep it at putting my work on t-shirts or prints and do a book so it can reach more people. It adds up. I can squeak by and still get my stuff out to people. The hard part is that I really want to do paintings, but at the end of the day, when I have these pieces and can show them, who can afford them? I want my work to be out there, but if I put six months into a painting, it’s worth a lot more, just in terms of time, if nothing else.

JR: Do you sell your paintings?

AH: I do. I’ve sold a handful. I did a few paintings three or four years ago and I sold most of those, but they were smaller wood panels. I didn’t have a chance to do anything that I wanted to show until last October when I had done a bunch of watercolor pieces. I sold half or so of them - they were all small. Most of my stuff is black and white, though, so color takes me a lot longer, and I’m still learning so I’m slightly less confident. I’m working on this big piece for Colombia now, though, and it’s going to be a big print. From that, I’m going to make a painting. I’m going to make a series out of it - hopefully by next year I’ll be able to show new paintings.

AH: Unfortunately I’ve also had to start saying no to a lot of commission stuff, which is money and work, but it's hard because you can’t charge a punk band that much money, and I’m also not going to give something half-assed. It's hard to spend a ton of time on something and then give it to someone for really cheap. I’ve been limiting what I say “yes” to, so I’ve been limiting myself to t-shirts, and paintings and art that I’m doing.

JR: Is there anyone contemporary who continues to be an influence on you in terms of visual art?

AH: Obviously people like Pettibon, I don’t know how contemporary we’re talking, but that whole spectrum of punk artists, and then people who are peers who are bringing it so hard. We all inspire each other so much. Sam Ryser who does Dripper World is unbelievable. He’s one of my favorite artists period, let alone a good friend, which blows my mind. And Eugene from Crazy Spirit, Emil from Dawn of Human, Heather Benjamin, who moved to Providence. She did a zine called Sad Sex, which is hyper gory hairy ladies - it’s really sick. And my partner Jess who’s in Anasazi is an amazing artist - she also helps me out in the studio. I literally don’t know how to paint so Jess will help me mix colors or do textures.

JR: How was it working with Sacred Bones doing the book you did?

AH: It was great. I love Caleb - he’s a sweetheart. I was happy to get my toe in a more mainstream world. He’s got more of a reach than anyone else I’ve worked with before, but Caleb’s also a punk and he understands punk so he didn’t push me to do anything I didn’t want to do or was uncomfortable. And then he did a great job on production. I was really happy to have made that decision and I’m definitely going to do another book for Sacred Bones once I get enough together, but rather than simply having a compilation of stuff, I’d rather have it be a interrelated and made for the book so it’ll be a piece in itself.

Release of the Day: Cult of Youth - Final Days

Cult of Youth changed my life. Years ago when I was still an undergraduate at Duke, I picked up Cult of Youth's self-titled record from Bull City Records. I was twenty years old and hadn't heard of neofolk or even folk punk. I didn't really, you know, "get it" at first: it was different than what I typically listened to, but it was a record to which I came back with frequency. It made me eager to here more, which I did with their 2012 album Love Will Prevail, one of my favorite records of that year.

A lot changed on October 20, 2012, when Cult of Youth played the Empty Bottle. It was the first time I had seen them, and I'm going to say right off the bat that I was fucking hammered at that show. I had been bonding with Christian and Jasper over alcohol at the bar but didn't meet Sean until he ran out the back door of the stage to smoke a cigarette atop a garbage can. I followed him back there and plopped down next to him, where we talked about mental illness and music. He later introduced me to Craig Lewis, who is doing incredible work as a Peer Counselor and giving talks on punk rock, mental illness, and recovery.

On March 9, 2013, I went to see Cult of Youth again and they took me in and brought me into the green room, which is where I met my now very close friend Jeffrey Cornille (of Jinx). First off, Jeff has gotten me in to so many incredible bands from Genocide Organ to Raspberry Bulbs to Pharmakon - he's really been important to my musical and artistic development so thanks if you're reading this, Jeff :) (I know you like emoticons so I put one in). Jeff would also later convince me to tour with Death in June and Cult of Youth on the East Coast, a defining chapter of my life, and also one of the major events that brought me in touch with industrial people and industrial culture. So my interests have changed more than a little because of Cult of Youth, but I've also made a ton of friends through them - so, first and foremost, I owe you guys some thanks. You've made a huge impact on my life and when you're back in Chicago, I owe you a round, though I'll stick to tea, myself, if you don't mind.

Anyway, with that exegesis out of the way, let's talk about their new fantastic album Final Days. This album is big in scale, sound, and approach. It came out in two entities: one as a single standard LP, and one as a Double LP with bonus songs and deluxe packaging. Sean has said that it is meant to be heard as the 2 x LP product and I'm certain that once mine comes in the mail that I will agree with him.

The album begins with a long intro "Todestrieb," meaning "death drive," sort of how humans are working towards our own destruction. I promote positivityThe Hunt, Cory Flanigan, and Paige Flash.
, but the realist in me can't help but look around and think that we're definitely on our death-driven pilgrimage. The song is made with human bones and clearly has a supernatural era of beings behind the veil of reality pulling strings or practicing magick. From there, the album enters familiar territory with songs rooted in an acoustic guitar before becoming an unyielding instrumental gyre. The band on this record is new, featuring Christian Kount and Jasper McGandy, previously of

In all sincerity, the five-piece layout seems to have fleshed out the music more, especially on a slow burner like "Sanctuary," my favorite track on the album, and in all sincerity a song that I wish I had written. It's monumental and really fucking intimidating, partially because of its length of more than nine minutes, but also its use of narrative framing like the acoustic intro, the build, the cantankering, climactic use of feedback and repetitive phrasing, the comedown, and ultimate denouement, which actually parallels the scope and flow of the entire album.

There are more obvious singles too, like the postpunk nugget "Empty Faction," linked below, which flies above a snaking, icy guitar lead from Christian Kount. It's the most rock n' roll song and also the most easily digestible, which isn't to detract from the song, but rather to invite in new listeners. Sean's shrieks are also at the forefront of this song, which in previous Cult of Youth records, were something of a treat, not a familiarity.

Final Days is absolutely the most fully-realized album in the Cult of Youth repertoire and a great place to begin to get to know the best current band in America. 

Release of the Day: Institute - Salt EP

If you've paid any attention to my blog, you know that one of the bands (if not the band) that has had the biggest "Holy Shit" effect on me this year has been Institute. I've written about two other releases from this year so why the fuck not write about their third release, which happens to be on Sacred Bones Records? The Salt EP is a step up in production, at least from their demo, and another step down in intelligible lyrics, which is fine by me. You get the sense of impending, demented nihilism from Moses' delivery though without a lyric sheet in hand, it is hard to know exactly what he's saying through palsied dribble.

I really wanted to be the first interview with this band, but Jane Chardiet beat me to it, who succeeds wonderfully in her piece, which is a great place to learn more about the band. I'm still holding out for an interview of my own, if anyone from Institute is reading this.

Salt contains my favorite Institute song, " Familiar Stranger," which has this sinister, snaking lead guitar take control of the song. I remember the first time I heard it, which was in a basement in NWI before Destruction Unit played and being fucking floored by how good it was. It hasn't had an official studio release until now, though it's on their live tape, which can be seen in full on this YouTube video. This video has a couple of songs that make their way on Salt, including the title track.

This high-caliber release from a band emerging from gestation is high-profile though, and could easily propel them out of DIY spaces. I wouldn't be surprised to see them on their own headlining tour soon, though I have a feeling that the best place to see Institute will always be in dusty, dark basements.

Premature Release of the Day: Pharmakon - Bestial Burden

I lucked out on being able to get my hands on Bestial Burden early, but upon listening, I realized that I had actually heard it before. If I'm not mistaken, other than the beginning song "Vacuum," seemingly sourced from uncomfortable, winding breaths, and "Primitive Struggle" sampled from victimized gags and regurgitation, I had actually heard this record before in a live setting. I noticed this from the rhythm section of "Intent or Instinct," which I remember hearing at Pharmakon's show with Haxan Cloak at the Church on York. Margaret had attached a contact mic to a heavy sheet and was beating it against her chest with her knuckles in the same pattern as is heard here.

Not to be crass and underhanded, but I think that as opposed to Abandon, Bestial Burden is more song-oriented or rather, focused on component parts. Miss Chardiet has been up front about some sort of physical ailment and resulting surgery that transfixed her mental capacity on a human body. It shows through the respiratory and digestive samples as well as her choice of artwork. Organs and flesh are strewn about in each piece of visual art from the alarming and strangely alluring cover art to the diorama-like cut-up inner sleeve. They make a person into not only its fundamental parts, but a commodity, like something you'd see at a meat-packing warehouse (trust me - I've been to them).

When I taught in Mexico, I had to manually slaughter, prepare, and dress farm animals for meals occasionally. It's more difficult than you would think from the killing aspect to the sectioning of different parts. For instance, when I had to kill a hog, it screamed like a human, which is a haunting sound that I will never get out of my head. During the preparation, I had to listen for where its heartbeat is and then stab the beating area with a serrated knife. But you can't just leave an animal alone when you need to make a meal for a family. So I had to pour boiling water over top and scrape off the hairs first before using a machete to physically separate what would be eaten at different times and every last part of that pig was eaten aside from its bones.

The art of Bestial Burden, and the title itself, reminds me of this. People are often too comfortable with seeing the casings of people or animals to know or think about what is inside. What makes an existence tick? I'm vegetarian and a lot of my reasoning has to do with finding our proximity to what we eat as inappropriate. An animal life becomes a commodity. I often hear someone say "Oh, I could never kill an animal, but I can eat this
burger." It doesn't really do the animal justice - it distances one being from the next and is disrespectful in my opinion. Having a neatly prepackaged meal or food item makes it easy for us to digest what maybe we should think about.

Margaret Chardiet is unfolding this thought diagram in Bestial Burden. It is uncomfortable and it is unpleasant, but it is also necessary.

Interview with Jes Aurelius of Destruction Unit

At this year's Not Normal Showcase, my friend T-Mac from American Hate/Glow God described the members of Destruction Unit as "conduits of sound." To be a conduit is to be a channeler, one who channels something from a different realm, a shaman of noise and sound, if you will. The description fits and is worn well by the gentlemen of Destruction Unit. These are men with an interest in the known and the unknown: a quick look into the somewhat-adjoined Ascetic House collective verifies this, as it puts out mind-bending cassettes, zines, and other ephemera.

This stuff is all related. The highly spiritual. The unclean recesses of man's id. Psychedelic drugs. Rock n' roll. Destruction Unit pulls these themes together and binds them in a neatly-closed package.

Let's go gonzo for a sec. You've just bought Deep Trip on vinyl. You tear off the shrink wrap like a child at Christmas, you insatiable fucking monster, before bending the wave-pattern front cover back and forth across your eyes, everything coming up distorted, and then diving into the LP and insert from within the cardboard fold. The insert is a page of fake blotter paper that maybe you eat because you need-need-need it in your life, though it never seems to take effect, which is the truly insidious part. You place the LP on your turntable in a faux-ritual and drop the needle, which is when the world begins to melt and sputter on its axis.

This is a band that has released a lot of material, especially for basically reinventing itself a few years back. In my opinion, it's all incredible. It takes the best of punk and krautrock and synthesizes them. Deep Trip itself has become one of my all-time favorite albums, though recordings can't possibly do the band justice. The group needs to be Experienced with a capital "E" to be understood and appreciated, which may explain why they seem to be in a permanent touring mode. They're playing Not Dead Yet Fest this year, which has a ridiculous lineup. I will surely be there.

Jordan Reyes: Destruction Unit started as a project with Ryan, Jay Reatard, and Alicja Trout. I know the majority of the current-day Destruction Unit members didn't ever share the stage with those those two, but did you guys ever get to meet or play with Jay or Alicja? Do they influence your output retroactively at all?

Jes Aurelius: I met Jay very briefly a couple of times, but it was before I had even met Ryan so it was under different circumstances. Destruction Unit was sort of on hiatus, and didn’t start up again until after Jay left his body. I can’t really speak for everyone, only for myself, but Jay’s spirit does influences me to some degree. That being said, I’ve got my own trip so it isn’t really a direct thing. Destruction Unit as most people know it is pretty unrelated to it’s beginnings, save for the name. 

JR: A lot of interviews and pieces on Destruction Unit and your other projects mention the desert. It's an easily romanticized locale with a lot of American mythos tied up in it. Are you guys all originally from the desert or moved there later in life?

JA: We are all more or less from here originally. It’s definitely a part of who we all are, physically and mentally. It influences everything we do in some way or another. I purposefully leave my guitar and amp in the car every 120+ degree day of summer. That’s where the desert sound comes from. It’s a very conscious thing.

JR: Do you think there are any remnants of an "Old American West" that still influence your artistic output?

JA: The west is where all the outlaws, misfits and drifters fled because there was no real structure or law. Today, the spirit of the wild west is very much alive here and it’s something we identify with quite a bit. Living on our own terms and making sure we’re one step ahead of the law is very much an every day part of our lives. That being said, this is not the old west, it is the 20th century, and looking backwards, being nostalgic or romanticizing the past doesn’t accomplish anything. We’re interested in the future, and moving things forward. 

JR: Where and how did you record Deep Trip? It's a record that sounds really huge when I listen to it - how much did recording location impact your sound versus effects?

JA: It was recorded in New York and produced by our friend Ben Greenberg. Location didn’t have much of an impact on the record as far as I can tell. What did have an effect was our schedule over the four days we recorded and mixed the album. We’d get to the studio at about 9am, record until4pm, then go play a show. We didn’t get to sleep before4am any of the nights we were out there, so running on about 3-4 hours of sleep maximum each day really pushed us to the point of total collapse. 

JR: How was it putting a record out on Sacred Bones? Had you guys been in contact with Caleb and friends for a while?

JA: Everyone at Sacred Bones are great. We’ve been friends since before they released our record, and there aren’t enough good things to say about all of them. Not many labels are willing to ensure a loss on a record in order to accommodate an artists vision, but that’s basically what they did with our record. They knew there’d be no way to recoup costs, at least not for a long time, on our record with how we wanted it to be packaged and presented, but they did it anyway because they supported our ideas. 

JR: I was also really curious about your three-way release with Merchandise and Milk Music. For me, that album really came out of nowhere (in a totally good way). How did you guys make that record?

JA: It was an idea that had been in the works for quite some time. Then the idea was sort of abandoned as everyone was too busy. Then it just happened somehow. Timmy [Hefner] worked some black magic. 

JR: I don't mean to jump the gun since you released Deep Trip last year as well as the 3-way LP, but have you guys started writing or recording new material at all?

JA: We’re taking it slow after so much touring. We’re working on new material now but not trying to rush it in the same way we did with the last album. Trying to give ourselves some more time and space to flesh things out.

JR: Figured I'd get in a couple AH questions you can choose to answer if you'd like:

Your Ascetic House collective recently finished a program of 30 tapes in 30 days. Can you tell me a little bit about how that program came to fruition?

JA: It was just an idea we had that seemed ridiculous and impossible so we had to do it. That’s basically it. 

JR: Ascetic House's dispersal system is really interesting to me. You sell products out of a small place in Arizona, and then have a bunch of distributors, right? Why not keep an online store?

JA: We don’t have the time to be running mail order ourselves and it’s not something that interests me at all. The point is to put these ideas out there, whether it be music, writing, art, whatever. Once they exist in the world, I can move on. Some of it is harder to find than others, but it will all find its way to the right people eventually. It’s not an elitist thing or a business thing, it’s simply how we operate right now. I’m more than willing to give copies of releases to anyone who approaches me, so long as I have copies, but I’m not going to go out of my way to make sure every collector has a complete collection sitting on their shelf.

JR: What would be something that people may not know about Destruction Unit from listening to your music?

JA: That each of us has actually been playing our respective instrument for a minimum of 10 years. Sure, it sounds like a mess of noise but it’s all skillfully crafted with precision and intent. We’re quite impressive actually.

JR: Anything else you'd like to say?

JA: Sorry this has taken me so long to get to you. Really enjoy your blog. Wish you the best.

Release of the Day: Institute - Giddy Boys 7"

I saw these guys with Destruction Unit twice at the end of May. One set was at the Void House in NWI and the other was at the Township. At the time, other than Destruction Unit, the only bands that I was familiar with who were playing were Carbonleak, Final Grin, and Gas Rag. Institute floored me, though. There's this angular sickness that comes out of the guitarist's strums and a dead-to-rights seriousness in the music. The singer is in a league of his own, though, man. I thought Moses Brown had minor cerebral palsy as he performed. He pigeon-stepped from side to side, wide-eyed, spitting and sputtering with a crumpled witch hand collapsed on his shoulder holding the mic. And when I saw him walk off after the set normally, I didn't know what to think. Had I just witnessed something incredibly offensive? Probably. And am I a bad person for loving it? Stay tuned, sportsfans.

Institute just released a great 7" on Brooklyn's premiere punk label Katorga Works, which has put out records by Ivy, Merchandise, Blotter, and more. It's called Giddy Boys and features another three demented punk songs from these sick fucks. You can check out the songs on their Bandcamp and while you're at it, give the Demo a spin too, which is excellent stuff in the vein of 80s California deathrock. This one is going to go fast too, especially with the news that these guys just signed with Sacred Bones for an upcoming 12" EP called Salt - I already preordered this and have heard some of the songs live or on their live cassette and these are some killer jams. I can't wait to see them come back through. Keep an eye on them because they are for sure going places.

Interview with Damon of Amen Dunes

Love is a gutsy name for an album. It's kind of like naming your album "religion" or "god" or "space." I personally struggle with the idea of love. It's all-encompassing idealization that may or may not be a myth. Does love exist? Can you wear it like a dusty jacket? Does it fly or slither? How old is it? It's personal and adaptable. Once you get to that malleable conclusion, it becomes a bit easier to walk in, stretched out like viscous lizard skin. Edible like cherry-flavored bouncy balls.

For reasons like this, it makes sense for the most recent Amen Dunes record to be called Love. Damon McMahon's new collection of eleven songs is something noticeably spiritual within the first few phrases and musical turns. It's like you shook the earth and saw all the dust rise. I'm waxing romantic, but for some reason, it's hard not to, and it boils down to the fact that Damon is out for big game. What does it mean to be a person and what part of that matters? Damon asks questions that beg misty ghost-colored answers. I find myself breathing into cold windows to watch the condensation - do the wet off-white speckles prove my existence?

Amen Dunes plays a mixture of folk, psychedelic something, and rock that seems to come and go with the wind. There is something natural within the words and feelings if you haven't gotten that yet. And let's be perfectly clear. This is special music. You can follow the band on their Facebook Page and you should buy the new album Love either at your local record shop or at the Sacred Bones website. Amen Dunes play Chicago on July 17 at The Constellation so be sure to check that out!

Jordan: Where are you guys playing in L.A.?

Damon: We’re playing at a place called Complex.

J: I don’t think I’ve ever been there.

D: I think it’s a new spot that people are playing after the Church on York closed.

J: Yeah, I was at that last Church on York show.

D: What was the last show?

J: Haxan Cloak and Pharmakon.

D: Oh Cool. Pharmakon is great live.

J: Yeah, she’s kind of intimidating to be honest.

D: Yeah, she’s super intense and great.

J: So tell me how the tour has been going so far.

D: It’s been good – we’ve had some van trouble, but overall it’s been positive. Canada, Detroit, and Boston were particularly great.

J: Who have you guys played with?

D: Well, we’ve been doing this whole tour with Axxa/Abraxas.

J: Are they on Captured Tracks?

D: Yeah.

J: I haven’t heard their stuff yet, but I know you’re coming through Chicago so I’ll see you guys then.

D: They’re good – they sound like Dead Moon or something.

J: That’s like one of my favorite bands of all time.

D: Yeah, they’re like a southwest Dead Moon. I don’t know if they sound different on record, but that’s 

how they sound live.

J: So what have you guys been listening to in the van?

D: We only had the radio for a while, so we hadn’t been listening too much to anything for a bit. The past couple of days have had us listening to Mickey Newbury. He was an early 70s Nashville guy – very good for driving through America in dust storms.

J: Tell me a little bit about recording and writing Love?

D: In what aspect?

J: How did you start writing the collection of songs that eventually ended up on it?

D: Well, some of these songs I wrote a while ago like over the last two years. It was a long process over time where I would listen to demos and come up with arrangements. Me, Jordi, and Parker would work through the ideas. Then we went to Montreal to track the basics before heading to Brooklyn to do some overdubs and then we had a bunch of months of mixing. The whole process lasted about a year.

J: Where did you record and mix in Brooklyn?

D: This place called Trout Recording with his guy Bryce Goggin. They did the last Swans record there.

J: Had you used the guy before?

D: No, but Parker knew him so he made the necessary introductions for us.

J: What’s the song “Lonely Richard” about?

D: It’s hard to say what it’s about. I think that one in general is harder to say what it’s about. It’s a bit of a self-portrait in addition to self-exploration. It talks about a guy who is aware of himself and I’m trying to talk about what that awareness is. Being in contact with other things. There’s a difference between creatures of earth and others. It’s about faraway places and having a connection with that.

J: As a human being?

D: Yeah, as a human being, but connecting with non-human beings or your own non-human being. I told you it was hard to talk about (laughs).

J: I listen to it all the time. For some reason, it really hits home, so I was very curious about it.

D: Yeah, I don’t know if you saw the lyrics sheet, but it kind of lays it out in a way. It’s a sort of character portrait.

J: Of yourself?

D: I think it is, but it’s also anyone who identifies with it. Anyone who is a composite creature.

J: Do you find yourself to be a spiritual person?

D: In my own way, definitely.

J: What do you think in your own life reflects your spirituality?

D: Probably my songwriting – that’s the most clear outward manifestation I think – it’s also the easiest way to access it.

J: Do you think art is inherently spiritual?

D: No. I think it can be done like that, but it isn’t necessarily that way. There are a lot of people who make art for different reasons. Some people do it for money. Some people do it to be cool. Some people do it for attention or to find themselves.

J: It’s one of those things that’s both individual and…I don’t want to say composite but…group-oriented.

D: Definitely.

J: Do you think Amen Dunes is more of the individual or group aspect?

D: Individual.

J: What about the live rendering of Amen Dunes?

D: Well, we try and convey what’s on the record. Even though the record has overdubs and stuff, most of the songs really boil down to three instruments. Doing it live is not that difficult actually. I thought it would be harder, but we can bring out the core elements pretty easily.

J: You’ve been touring a lot lately. Even before Love came out, you were touring with Mac Demarco, right?

D: Yeah – I went out with him a couple times.

J: I was a little surprised by that lineup. How did you guys get connected?

D: He reached out to us to go on tour with him. I guess he was a fan. It was a little bit of an odd pairing just because his audience is very different from our typical audience. I think in the bigger cities it worked well, though. Oftentimes, I would be playing to people who wouldn’t really know what we were about.

J: You were with my friend Cory during that, weren’t you?

D: Totally. Cory did the Mac tour.

J: How did you guys get linked up? I was surprised by that too.

D: Yeah, he plays in Cult of Youth on Sacred Bones.

J: Yeah, Sean’s a buddy of mine too.

D: Oh cool. Yeah, we had to find someone to play drums pretty much last minute so Cory sort of miraculously appeared and was super down to do it in addition to being a great drummer so he just sort of came on board. It was awesome.

J: It seems that people on Sacred Bones kind of fill in for each other pretty easily. A lot of people will record or overdub at Heaven Street. It seems like a more collaborative label.

D: It is, man. I would say that Sacred Bones is a great operation in that way. It is kind of family-oriented. I think most of the bands have mutual respect for one another. There’s more of a connection with that label between bands then with bands on other labels.

J: Have you worked with other labels? I know you put Spoilers out on your own.

D: Yeah, I’ve worked with lots of labels. I had a band when I was a kid and we were on like three different labels and then I did a solo record that was on another. The first Amen Dunes record was on another label and I’ve released seven-inches and singles on other labels too. In all my experience, I really do think that Sacred Bones is one of the best.

J: That’s cool to see that a label that’s so all across the board with releases from like Human Eye to Pharmakon.

D: It’s definitely diverse and I think that’s important.

J: I completely agree. I personally think that mixed bills are the best way to go for music. If you just get into one genre, it kind of defeats the purpose of music at all.

D: I totally agree. I love playing with bands that are different from us. Amen Dunes is cool because it can fit in with a lot of different styles of music. I think you have to be somewhat open-minded to see the connections, but it is somewhat malleable.

J: What’s the craziest pair that you guys have played with?

D: We played with Boyd Rice when he did NON again.

J: WHOA!

D: That was great, man. It was a great honor.

J: I body-guarded for him once.

D: You did? That’s funny.

J: Didn’t stop a smoke bomb from going off though. It was me and my friend Jeffrey – I think you met him at the Chicago show. We were body-guarding and neither one of us realized what had happened and sure enough, someone had used a smoke bomb.

D: Whoa. Was it friendly or not friendly?

J: I think it was supposed to be unfriendly but I actually thought it kind of added to the show.

D: Someone threw a smoke bomb when we played on the Fourth of July.

J: Why did they do that?

D: I don’t know (laughs). To add to the ambiance?

J: I guess that was…nice of them?

D: Yeah. It was cool – it added to the vibe for sure.

J: Do you guys have a visual element when you perform?

D: No – I would like to, and I wish we did have a visual element, but I haven’t gotten that together. I think it really helps when a band has that. I think it can also be a gimmick, though. There are bands that you’ll see that have a visual element where it’s their whole shtick, but it can also totally add to the performance too.

J: Totally. Like Mark McGuire – have you ever seen him?

D: I haven’t – does he do visuals.

J: Yeah, he’s got that new age vibe but not in a douchey way. There’s a backdrop and there are sometimes voiceovers about our world or self-actualization. One of my friends was like “Oh man, that was weird” and all I could think was “I just learned a shit ton from that.”

D: That’s cool. I’d like to do that and I like it when people go out on a limb with that.

J: If someone had a gun to your head and asked you what your backdrop would be, what would it be?

D: I’d like to play in front of the right kind of movie. I think the music is already kind of like that in a way. It’s somewhat cinematic. Playing in front of a good movie would rule.

J: Are you a fan of film?

D: Totally.

J: What are some of your go-to favorite movies and directors?

D: Probably my favorite director is John Cassavetes. As far as favorite movies, I would say the movie My Dinner with Andre is there. I like Diary of a Country Priest and a lot of Truffaut movies. A whole bunch of stuff.

J: I’ve never seen it.

D: It’s great. It’s about an actor and a director who haven’t seen each other for like ten years and they get dinner and just catch up. It’s really simple, but it’s also really great. My favorite Cassavetes movie is probably A Woman Under the Influence. Have you seen that?

J: No, I haven’t seen that either!

D: Oh, it’s the best. For a while, that is what I wanted Amen Dunes to be –I wanted it to be that movie. You have to see it – it’s incredible. Gena Rowlands is in it, who’s Cassavetes’ wife, is the lead in it.

J: Do you know the band Wrekmeister Harmonies?

D: Yeah

J: The first time I saw him/them, he had Haxan: Witchcraft Through the Ages on in the backdrop and it was a small screen, but it really worked, in addition to being just a great movie anyway.

D: I love to see bands do that.

J: Can you think of any good examples of bands who you’ve seen do that?

D: Yeah, there was this band Launau who performed by herself and it was mesmerizing. She played an old Finnish movie behind her and it was one of the most beautiful things I’ve seen.

J: I love asking interview about stuff like this – I’m always looking to broaden my horizons. Do you read a lot too?

D: Yeah, I like to read a lot. I’m probably more interested in that world than music actually. I just feel like there’s more to learn in writing. Music, especially rock, is a little bit limited. At a certain point in time, it becomes harder to find something new. Over time, if you’re really curious, it becomes hard to find something new that you haven’t heard before, but with writers there is always just so much stuff that I haven’t read.

J: Do you write as well?

D: I do. That’s my other passion. I’d like to do more of it.

J: Have you ever written a novel?

D: I’m about halfway through one – it’s not really a novel. I used to live in China. I’ve been writing this thing since 2007 about my time in China. I’ve yet to finish it, but I’ve been working on it for a long time.

J: How was China?

D: It was incredible. It was the best. I think about it all the time.

J: I’ve never been to Asia. I would love to travel there – I’m a bit of a Japanophile.

D: Japan’s amazing.

J: You’ve been there too?

D: Yeah, I haven’t spent extended periods of time there, but when you go to China, there’s often a layover in Tokyo. I always take advantage of that and I have friends who live there so I get to hang around.

J: So what were you doing in China?

D: I was trying to get out of New York and take a break from music actually. I can speak Chinese, though, and I had studied Chinese for a while before I left, so I was already somewhat connected. I found a job there and I was already trying to get away from music.

J: How did you get to the point of wanting to get away from music?

D: New York is just intense. I had been in bands for like five years at a full capacity and it just burned me out. I just got kind of sick of it. It was time to take a break.

J: Does playing music take a toll on you?

D: Touring does. Playing music itself is regenerative.

J: Do you think it’s more the driving then the playing?

D: It’s a whole bunch of stuff. The cool thing about touring is that there are amazing highs and lows. Some of the best moments are on tour when you have great shows and meet interesting people so it evens itself out. It’s not like a penance.

J: A lot of people think there’s a divide or a mutual exclusivity between playing live and recording, but what do you think of that relationship?

D: I think they’re pretty different. Recording is a whole different beast. I’ve never been able to do live what I can do on record.

J: Do you think recording is regenerative or does it take a toll?

D: It can wear you down too. Making music, if you do it sincerely, takes a lot of energy. You have a lot invested and care about. It’s not a 9-5 vibe. You take it with you all the time. It is you.